Islam is.....

Friends,

I have received an email from a muslim friend,which reads as follow,

hello how are you ??

i feel sorry for what happened in india:(

i support u and feel with u 

if the attackers are muslims,,then all muslims feel shame from  them

if the prophet mohammed himself alive,, he will feel shame from

them 

allah bless u friend:D

_

I feel it is what real Islam is , & I feel proud of such religious humans.

Dev 

for me when we talk about terrorists and terrorism, we should say just: terrorsit and terrorism.not islamic terrosrist or islamic terrorism. because those who did this criminal act have no religion and don't believe in GOD. because in islam the one who kill innocent people is not muslim.

Dear Blink,

One needs power to use double standerds,If one does not have logical power then one tries 'gun' to let the people accept their idea, it is what is happening in Pakistan.You say Pakistan has given the right to vote to Kashmiri's but I ask you ,hasPakistan government  given the right to vote to it's citizens ? there is jungle raj in pakistan & how it can claim to give right Kashmiris?

Pakistan uses double standareds to see happenings but when it fails it uses 'guns' , help to train terrorists,help to give arms & all crimnal people, to serve it's purpose.

But it is necessity of Pakistan government, because it search grounds to keep itself alive & so divert the attention of Pakistani citzens so as not to claim 'right to vote',it's way to dictaorship.

  I agree to your point that Big countries use situations according to their choices & interests. USA & USSR are fully responsible for such situations, they gave air to such movements  & 9/11 were the  fruits of the seeds they sewed.

Pakistan was a toy in the hands of USA but as situations changed after dissolving of USSR, the whole spectrum changed. 

Funny Shadow,

I agree to your view that aterrorist is just aterrorist & has no religion,but it happens

In Punjab ( an state of India ) there was terrorism between 1979-92, The people of 'Sikh community' ( which have separate physical identity, like prime minister of India) were supported by Pakistan.I remember every sikh was suspected as terrorist, It's human psychology, fear of minds create such images in our mind,These becomes convictions of our unconscious mind & we loose our independent vision.

It becomes a natural trend to doubt any body who resembles to terrorist. 

Hmmm… Topic diverting off topic. This has been getting into a politicl thing. As for lilimira I would like to ask he you say neither peace nor was can address the Kashmir issue then come on give up a solution. Or should we just leave it like that.
And you ask how to attack pakistan he it has atomic bomb. Just dont forget pakistan is not US. If it ever uses or even tries to use them then it will have to suffer from the said of other countries as well who will feel insecure. US can silence all but not pakistan. Just owning a nuclear warhead is just like the guards of Taj hotel who had guns but not permission to fire.
I would have very much liked to reply to blink as well but sadly since I am on mobile I cant collect the whole chunk of info so as to reply. But just one thing.
You say pakistan claims Kashmir. But why? When both countries became free all the states were free to chose their ways. Kashmir first remained independent and then Hari singh mixed Kashmir with India. And if you say Indian govt. Does not give them enough then I will say it a plunder. A good deal of central budget goes to Kashmir which should have gone to other states. Kashmiris get a lot of reservations. They get many facilities. They are exempt of a lot of regulations. If they still are impoverished then it is due to bureaucrats and politicians. And if you say bureaucratic and political system is better and more transparent in pak then it would be like a bad joke. Birds of same feather. If Kashmiris wanna be with Pakistan or be independent and the issue is really solved then as an Indian I would prefer to let them go. Those who cry hoarse “Dudh mangoge khir denge, Kashmir mangoge cheer denge.” be damned. But that is not the case. Kashmiris know acceding to pakistan wont improve their stance, and getting independent will only leave them more vulnerable to Pakistani militant (non state actors) attacks. Lol…

we should not leave it like that and both governments should understand that it's no need to claim each other guilty.the issue can  be solved by staying on a table and talking  objectively about the matter and a solution can be found even if a foreign interference in the negociations is needed.but i was just talking about those politicians and i think that both sides are not able to be wise.i don't think pakistan will use the atomic bomb,there's a more powerful weapon and it's terrorism and those silly reactions just give terrorism more ground and opportunities to do target job and guess who are the only victims? not those politicians for sure.

An imagination of situation,when India & Pakistan  were getting divded an problem occured,there was a mad house through which the border line demarked by politcians pssing,dividing the mad house into two parts,so an idea came to erect an wall inbetween the mad house in to two parts but mad people did not allowed any wall to be created, they said that we are enjoying well & we don't want our house to be divided,so it was decided to ask from the mad people ,their choice & do accordingly.

Mad people were called & asked in which country they wanted to join , mad people said we want live here where we are , we don't want to shift any where else.

politicians tried to console them stating that you will remain here where you are living but just let us know which country you want to join. mad people again replied that we don't want to go any where else, we want to live here we are living, so there is no question of joining  or leaving any country.

Mad peole could not understand the language of politician talking about & politicians were fighting upon the line control.

A madness is required to understand the facts of life, but unfortunately that is grabbed by politicians , religions, families, & all whom we consider 'me & mine',

The land remains where it is just names change in record, the ownership changes for a while ( we just feel that it is my property) but it always remain out side & we die leaving it where it is.

We just fight for nothing & we consider our self,'the people of great understanding'.

I wish all people to learn lesson from the people of mad house, how to live in togetherness.

Thanks 

Let me answer for Dev

If here in Pakistan is jungle Raj than what is there in India and rest of the world?

90% of the India has rule of Law, except for a few states like bihar, UP and Bengal. There is naxal violenece in some parts Orrisa , Andhra , Jharkhan and chhatisgadh

India is a vast country, some % of people live the lives of a "first world" country, and some live like people in "sub-saharan Africa" . It is tough for a any govt to have complete control of country which has all "races" in the world from caucasians, negriods, Mogolids to pygmys(ethnic to the country)

What happened when the Samjota Express train was bombed and it was alleged on Pakistan?

India never blamed Pakistan on that issue, It was blamed on HUJI, which carried out the mecca masjid blast in Hydrabad. It also shows the greatness of India, No one is above law. The army officer was caught and is being tried in court.  That army officer is called a terrorist as well. We don;t have a double standards ( any how this is an ongoing investigation )

What was the logic for interfering in the east Pakistan? was there any?

Ya, you are right, I agree with you with this issue. We were stabed in the back by bangladesh, for helping them.

what was the logic of killing minorities (Christians, Muslims, dalits) in India?

Can you tell me who is a minority in India? India is a land of Minorities.

How many have been killed ? do you have the figures?

Muslims   I think nasim has answered it well in page 3 of this thread. and i will let nasim answer this as well.

Christians this "anti christan" riots  happen only in tribal belts. UneducatedGulliably tribals are paid money by the christian missionries to convert.(Evangalists). They are brain washed into thinking that thier way of life is evil.

Hindu right wing organizations like RSS would never let that continue and will fight for it. They are completly against "forced" conversion.

Dalits -  When the british left, the education level was 13.3 , 90 of all Indians were poor. What is it now? education has reached 70%, poverty is at 30%.

Narayanan was the president of the contry. He was a dalit. Mayawati  is  a dalit, and could be the next PM of the country!!

More than 30% of the seats are reserved for dalits.

And if you are under the impression that dalits only among hindu's , then you are wrong. Muslim and christan dalits are discriminated by other Muslim/christinans as well.

There are more than 17 separatist movements emerging in India and why it can not be addressed? Do you think it would not proliferate terrorism logically?

Look at what happened in Punjab. there was Militancy on the scale of kashmir in 1980's. .Former PM was even killed by terrorists.Where is it now? no where to be seen except in canada, where only50 people turned up for "khalistan movement" last year. there were no takers. similar fate awaits kashmir and other seperatist movements in India

Were Kashmir's the slaves of Hari Singh that  he mixed Kashmir with India without their consent? 

were muslims the slave of Jinnaha? or were hindu;s the slave of Nehru?

Do you think force is the solution for these problems?

Not sure, I am certanily not for war between pakistan and India. But i may support surgical strikes in what we call POK and what you call Azad kashmir,but  only if Pakistan fails to act.

I say again and again that this is not the way to deal with terrorism rather to make efforts to root out the causes of terrorism

If religion is not invloved, then all kinds of issues can be solves. 

How can a govt solve a problem, when some one wants to blow thier fellow country men because US is bombing Iraq? 

Why is it that attack on Iraq has suddenly become war on Islam? When US attacks Iraq, then it is 2 countries going to war. But what happened? War in Iraq has become a relgious struggle!! 

Now as a hindu should I support a terrorist organization like LTTE because they hindu's? Even they are "freedom fighters". 

there will always be people who are disgrunteled people.  Should the Govt ban all rock music just becuse some people don;t like it? 

some muslims want to do some terror activty in UK because they want sharia for muslim's? what logic is that?

Friends,

I feel we (the public has) been exploitted too much,both physically, psychlogically & mentally too, in such a clever way that it's beyond our power to understand the game of politician & religious peole.

I feel it a game being played political people who are under the dress of religious people & so so called religious peole are nothing but politcal in their actual character.

& politcal people exploit us in the names of natinality too.

Birds are free to travell all around , why their are barriers for human ?Earth is one why so many countries ? but we have been taught & trained to die to prove ourself patriot ?one person is patriot in few eyes & the same person is terrorist for the other . It is just the difference of of our 'view'.Politician use us to kill & die in order to keep them secure.They need some techniqe to make us fool, so they give such education that we may not question.

So called religious education is also an techniqe to exploit us, it gives answers to all our common questions.It makes us feel 'sinner' if we don't follow any religion, & promise (paradise after death only)if we follow them.If we can go to paradise after death why can't we go that pardise just now ?why there is no paradise when we are alive ?all are just consolations & ways to control our mind. 

Real religiousness is beyond all religions. it is our aliveness, our happiness , our satisfaction, our confidence our sharing, our love.

We are fighting for nothing, what makes the difference ? Kashmir is just Kashmir & it is where it is , no body can it hold it in his hand or take it any where. But the people which died there due to struggle lost their lives just by  becoming tools in the hands of politicians. But still we ( the public)has no sense to save our selffrom becoming pray of politicians.  

Do you think Pakistan will allowed these kind of strikes….

No. That's the reason I added the word may

don't you think that it will be the first step toward war?

probably yes. also it will be the last option. and possiblity of war right now is remote

Would your government also allow Pakistan for similar strike on LTTE headquarters if Indian government failed to act? 

 iff  it failed to act

who told you that? how much you know about the terrorism in Pakistan? Do you know what is happening in the tribal areas of Pakistan and do you know the links of these terrorism?

I was talking about terroism is general. I was wathcing an interview with bali bomber amarosi. the sole reason he bombed bali was because injustice happens in Palestine. 

 Most of these attacks are cross border terrorism from Afghanistan via tribal areas of Pakistan by USA and Indian Raw to destabilize Pakistan.

india would be the last person who wants to destabalize pakistan.If pakistan is destabalized, the nukes could fall into those terrorists. and then there will be armageden!! RAW is not an extra-judicial force and is under direct control of the president and the PM of the country. 

how you came to that conclusion? and if that was the war between US and Iraq than what the forces from other western countries are doing there?

Well these are other countries helping US. Why didn't syria, egypt etc send thier forces to help saddam?  

Do you still think this is a justified war ( terrorism)?

Yes you have rightly said, this is terrorism. and I will not justify it 

 When different countries raged terrorism on other country than it is justifiable and when other friendly countries condemn them and sympathize than you call it Islamic struggle!!!

then why don't the same people who support "freedom struggle" , support kardistan movement, FARC , LTTE? The only reason these people want to support the "freedom strugle" si because they are told that muslims are victimized.

During Gujarat riots 3000 indians(75% muslims) were killed, but in arab countries, the figure become 50,000 muslims!! 

People talk about oppression of muslims in India, but the same people don;t even know that muslims in India are more free than people from many of the  middle eastern countries.

People are constantly fed false and exagurated news.

Bush himself used the word crusade in one of his speech but never have any Muslim country government labeled Iraq war as an Islamic struggle, have they?!!!

Crusede is a present day word for struggle. it  is not like "jihad" or "dharma yudha". Any how I don't want to support a fool named bush.

who on earth can support these kind of people. and by the way where you have heard this news…..

a documentary by some middle eastern channel(they were compltly supporting this. They called it opperssion of muslims in this case too)